Bush Early Girl Tomato

[lorak4195]

78 days ago I planted three pods of Bush Early Girl I got from Reiner Seeds.com. I've always loved the taste of Early Girl Tomatoes and wanted to try that in my Ultra LED 7 pod AeroGarden.  The three different pods sprouted and grew great.  Once they were about 12 inches is when the leafs started curling.  I always used distilled water.  They did flower and I do have a few tomatoes.  I was adding 2 capfuls of the Aerogarden Nutrients every 14 days and at 30 days I did a drain and refill.  That didn't help.  I removed the middle plant thinking they were starving from nutrients.  That didn't help.  I kept the light 3 inches away from the plant that didn't help.  I reduced the light on time that didn't help.  I also tried switching to my well water which had a 200ppm reading and did the 24 hour test of 1 gal well water with some nutrients in a dark place and it seemed to be fine.  That didn't help.  I got some GH cal/mag and the PPM and pH meters www.amazon.com/dp/B08S2YS52F?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details and did another drain and refill at 68 days.  For the refill I added the 2 cap fulls then recommended amount of cal/mag then added more capfuls until the PPM was around 800 that didn't help.  They almost died with all that I added.  They came back but leaves still are curling.  The pH meter has some weird readings as when I put it in it starts at 7.50 then counts down 7.45, 7.40, 7.45, 7.35, 7.40, 7.30.  The room is a heated room at 68 deg.

What other things could I do? Could it be my pH? If I need to do pH down what brand of stuff should I get?  Should I get a better meter? Do I need a fan to blow on it?  Is there a better tomato Nutrient specific solution vs the AG nutrients?

I would be okay with starting over just I don't know how starting over would fix the leaf curl.

[scarfguy]

You didn't mention the pump?  Is your pump working?

[lynnee]

lorak4195, do check the pump, as scarfguy suggested.

What do the roots look like? Are they a healthy white or light brown? The plants could have root rot, in which case they probably can't be saved. If the roots are black, dark brown, or mushy, you could try trimming off the bad parts.

I started doing R&Rs every 2 weeks after losing a prized bell pepper plant quite suddenly to root rot. If you start over, be sure to clean your Bounty thoroughly--in the dishwasher if you dare, or by following the AG instructions for disinfecting with bleach.

900 ppm is kinda high, but not fatal. My tomatoes usually come in around 600 ppm when the water is completely fresh with 12 ml of AG nutrients added at the third feeding. For tomatoes in a Bounty or Bounty Elite, I add 12 ml AG nutes, 3-5 ml CalMag, and 2-3 ml KoolBloom from the third feeding on, and do an R&R every two weeks.

I no longer test the pH for tomatoes, but I've never been able to use a pH meter successfully. The readings shift around the way that you describe. To test pH, I use this General Hydroponics PH Testing Kit.. I use dispensing syringes to draw the measured amounts of testing liquids (e.g., Rachel's Closeouts).

The one other thing that occurs to me, is that the plants may be in the draft from a furnace heating vent. The vent might be far away, across the room, but the draft can be extremely damaging. Also, indoor rooms can have extremely low humidity in winter.

However, the leaf curl visible in your photo suggests a problem with the plant itself--probably a disease or a root problem. If the pump is not working, it could cause what you're seeing, because the plant would be sitting in stagnant water (no oxygen).

[lorak4195]

The pump is working and set at 3 I think. I see the water flowing in all seven pods the 5 with their covers. The roots have been healthy white. They look just like the roots I had last with a thriving jalapeño pepper. I didn’t do a disinfect but thought since it’s been like three years since I used it last and I cleaned with soap and water I thought I would be alright.

At 2 capfuls when I did the r&r the ppm was like 300. Maybe my PPM meter is off although my well water is 77 ppm and the distilled is 0. Will it matter if I use well water as it hasn’t seem to do anything different? I did have a heat pump installed in our house, after I grew the jalapeño pepper happily, and the ceiling air vent is 6 feet away but I don’t feel any air from the vent and it’s to the side.

What could I do about the indoor air? I don’t really have other places to put the Aerogarden without vents. Should misting them with a spray bottle mornings and evening help? Do I need to put up some kind of wall to ensure no draft or put a low speed fan on them when the light is on?

I’ll start doing the R&R every 2 weeks and do 12 ml AG nutes, 3-5 ml CalMag, and order some KoolBloom. What is the best way to do the R&R? Both times I almost split the main stem by taking the Aerogarden top off and setting them aside. It’s very tough to do.

[scarfguy]

I don't really do a complete R&R for the very reason you mention.  I just use a siphon to drain as much of the water as I can and then replenish with fresh water immediately.  It doesn't give me an opportunity to check the roots or the pump or the sensor BUT with 15 aerogardens, the syphon method is already a full-time job!

At this point, I think you've agonized over this plant long enough.  It may indeed be a virus or something out of your control.   I would pitch it. Sanitize your aerogarden.  Get some fresh seeds (from a different vendor). And try again.

[darais211]

why are you using distilled water? thats basically dead water if you want to give them a different kind of water i would use purified or RO those are much better, but at this rate we are getting into hydro-chemistry. i would say do a complete Res change with those 2 kinds of water and see what happens.

and when was the last time you calibrated your PH meter? and at 7.5 you are going to cause some nutrient lockout.

here's a chart that i use to help me:

[katyag247]

darais211   Lots of folks who live in areas with extremely hard water use distilled water in our Aerogardens.  That's what Aerogarden recommends for people who live in Florida and Texas, and it has worked well for me.  The pH of my tap water is typically between 8-9 (sometimes over 9), and the TDS readings are ridiculously high.  I'd dearly love to live someplace where I could use tap water rather than making several gallons of distilled water every week.  I'm looking into RO water but distilled water is the best choice for me right now.

[scarfguy]

Jan 17, 2023 10:41:10 GMT -5 katyag247 said:

darais211   Lots of folks who live in areas with extremely hard water use distilled water in our Aerogardens.  That's what Aerogarden recommends for people who live in Florida and Texas, and it has worked well for me.  The pH of my tap water is typically between 8-9 (sometimes over 9), and the TDS readings are ridiculously high.  I'd dearly love to live someplace where I could use tap water rather than making several gallons of distilled water every week.  I'm looking into RO water but distilled water is the best choice for me right now.

katyag247,  Wouldn't it be easier and quicker just to use tap water and add a bit of "pH down" to adjust the pH to the appropriate level??? 

Your dissolved solids shouldn't be a problem depending upon what those dissolved solids are.  (arsenic and cyanide would probably not be good)

[airscapes]

Have not been around much, but after install and RO system in my  kitchen 2 years ago, I would say it is one of the best investments I have made.  I do not have really bad water, the public supply is half decent but has a lot of chlorine.  I went  with a system that put calcium and magnesium back in the RO water so it tastes good and had a PH of about 7ish.  I also added a UV filter and we have had very tasty water at all times.    I highly recommend www.theperfectwater.com/ , the product is excellent and the support is second to none.  My reserve tank is in the basement under the kitchen sink area and works great, it does not have to be under the sink.  Same goes for the entire system if placing it under the sink is a problem..  Hope that help someone make the investment as it really is money well spent.

[katyag247]

Hi scarfguy , I know it seems like an unnecessary step, but the tap water here is extremely hard with high levels of calcium which interferes with the uptake of other nutrients, especially phosphorus.  Friends have tried using tap water and adjusting the pH but it was an extra headache and didn't work out well.  

I love Aerogardening because it's easy and virtually every crop has been successful.  For me, it's easier to start with neutral water and then add the recommended nutrients rather than monitoring fluctuating pH levels and guessing about calcium levels when deciding whether to use a CalMag product.  As a bonus, it's easy to keep the Aerogardens clean -- definitely easier than keeping the mineral sludge off of the faucets and shower heads, ha!!  

Thanks airscapes for the info about RO systems.  It's definitely something to consider.  I also garden outdoors -- is all of the water treated by the RO system, including your outdoor faucets? 

[airscapes]

Jan 17, 2023 12:05:00 GMT -5 katyag247 said:

Thanks airscapes for the info about RO systems.  It's definitely something to consider.  I also garden outdoors -- is all of the water treated by the RO system, including your outdoor faucets? 

They make whole house system, and hydrogarden systems (not much different than the under sink unit as far as filtering), but the one I have is  just for drinking and cooking with a separate faucet in the kitchen. www.theperfectwater.com/home-master-tmafc-artesian-full-contact-reverse-osmosis-water-filtration-system.html

[lynnee]

lorak4195, I defer the others here for advice about water. However, if well water works for you, then it's fine. I've read that half distilled water, half tap water works well for some people. Your plant could be suffering from nutrient lockout due to the water.

If the roots are healthy, then I'd wait a while to pitch the plant--especially because it is bravely producing tomatoes. I would look closely at growing conditions in the room. Start by pruning off all of those branches with dried-up or curled leaves. (Leave any branches with healthy blooms, but prune off all curled or yellowed leaves, as they won't come back.) Keeping those dead leaves interferes with air circulation, and seems to burden the plant, too.

To counter low winter humidity, misting should help, or you could try using a small cool mist humidifier in the room.

Do look again for drafts when the furnace is on and sending out heat. One of my AGs gets a strong air current when the furnace is on, even though the vent is far away and the air isn't warm. This same AG is near a cracked-open window, and the cold draft from there sometimes dries out tomato plant leaves badly. A tent or shield may help with drafts and humidity, but I haven't personally tried this.

The 68 degree room temperature should be okay. Did you check the water temperature? Water that's very much over 72 degrees F. will cook the plant--but this problem will usually show up in the roots.

I forgot to mention that Koolbloom is an optional supplement, although it increases flower production and helps retain fruit that has set. Adding Koolbloom has tremendously improved my cherry tomato production! If you use it, add smaller amounts than the label recommends at first--too much can shock your plants.

Your plant still may have a disease, but the healthy roots say otherwise.

With Bounties, I now empty the bowls completely at R&Rs, but I used to siphon the water and my plants did fine.

When I'm draining the bowls, I unplug the pump, and tilt the deck forward to remove the plants. (Sometimes I raise the lights, too.) Then I set the plant and deck into a bus tray temporarily until I can dump and refill the bowl. (Thank you, campingcorgis!) The roots don't seem to mind this--they're very forgiving.

At this time I also trim the roots if it seems like a good idea, and clear roots out of the pump filter and water level indicator. To replace the plant, I just tilt the deck back in the same way it came out. Then I plug in the pump as soon as I've added water.

[katyag247]

Sorry lorak4195, I didn't mean to hijack your post with all of my chatter about distilled water vs. RO vs. tap.     Thanks for all the good advice in your post, lynnee!  Especially the link to the bus tray...exactly what I've been looking for.    

[lynnee]

As it happens, I was draining Bounties today. Here are two Sweet Heat peppers from a recent Grow-Along, resting temporarily in a gray bus tray. They were planted 182 days ago, so many roots are brown, but there are white roots threaded through.

[katyag247]

Thanks for showing the bus tray in action.  The peppers look great too!  I grew Sweet Heat peppers outdoors last summer but those look so much better.  

[lorak4195]

Thanks everyone for all the suggestions. I closed the vent in that room yesterday and I'll continue to monitor it. I checked the tds again and it was 800ppm. The next R&R is in 2 days. I checked the water temperature and it is 77 degrees.  I figured out it's coming from the control unit panel as it's around 80 degrees.  I'm pretty sure that's my problem and I have a plan to fix that.  I never realized it could be the unit itself.  Back when I planted the seeds I found out my LED light wasn't working and just blinking.  I contacted Aerogarden but they would not sell me a replacement LED light anymore...they were for sale when I bought the unit.  Instead of spending another couple hundred bucks I researched DIY fixes and determined what I thought was the light power supply was faulty.

I wasn't sure the wattage and the voltage of the light panel so did more research.  Two YouTube videos  and different approaches but I went with the new external power supply and just plugged the power supply into the light and the unit.  In the comments for one of the videos a person said "There are a few different hoods. I have two 12 volt, 30 watt hoods and 1 24 volt, 45 watt hood. If you don't want to mess with capacitors, you can buy an appropriate power block (think laptop type cord) and wire it right in, bypassing the power block under the lamps - just throw that away. You'll have a power block outside of your hood, but if you make sure to get the right type of connector to the block, you can use the lamp cord on the aerogarden (Plug it into the new power block instead of the hood) and that way the aerogarden timers still turn the lights on and off. About 10-15 bucks for a power adapter. Not as neat, but more doable for those with less electronics comfort."  I knew mine was 30W but still wanted to double check the voltage.

To figure out the voltage needed I got the power supply to work for strobing lights and put a volt meter on it and the voltage stayed at minimum 8.5 and went all the way up to 9.9.  If it was in the high teens I could pretty much assume 24v but it's not. There's 4 leds for each parallel run printed on the board not 3 nor 6 so I still wasn't quite sure if it's 24v or 12 v based on a standard light strip. It does have a label on the light panel "30W-V3.1-3116" so thought 4 lights in series needs 4x3.1 =12.4V.  Both the labels and the test confirmed it was likely 12V.  I tested the light on a 12 Volt Car Battery starter and it lit up perfectly.  If 12 volts wasn't enough pretty sure it would have been dim and not even had enough power to light.  So at a minimum I need 30W and 12V DC so went with double that, 60W, and 12V at amazon www.amazon.com/dp/B07GFFG1BQ?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1.  I tried plugging it into the Aerogarden plugin but when the light was off the power supply light blinked.  I figured there was some sort of control signal coming through so just plugged the light into a manual outlet timer.  I never thought that the control board and/or pump power supply could be bad as I think that's the problem.  It shouldn't heat up so much.  I determined I won't need the control panel...although for future plantings I'll have to figure out the pump and light schedule for germination vs high growth mode.  The high growth mode runs the pump 24/7, I verified the pump is 3W and 12V, bought a duplicate 60W power supply as well as a female to female adapter and just plug it into the wall and plug the pump into it.  I'm pretty sure this has been the problem all along.

Thanks again everyone.

[lynnee]

lorak4195 , thanks for coming back and giving us all that information! It does sound like you're on the way to a proper solution.

Here are the links for the two videos above, if you want to go direct to YouTube to watch. Remove the brackets to enable them.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UU7ohY7acg]

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BJOldYFqho&t=9s]

[lorak4195]

Update
When I received the power supply and the 5.5mm female to female adapter I doubled checked the pump one last time.  I realized it was 12V AC not DC.  I purchased a 1 Amp 12V AC power supply and when it arrived plugged it in.  Again I made another mistake the 5.5mm adapter I got was 5.5mm x 2.1mm and it didn't work so purchased the correct 5.5mm x 2.5mm female to female adapter.  It arrived yesterday and I plugged it in.  Unfortunately the temperature was still 74 deg F which I'm pretty sure is still too high.  I did some research and learned if the pump runs continuously, like mine does on high growth mode, it will heat up the water.  I read on a couple posts that people get by with a 5 min on 25 min off pump cycle like what is set for lettuce.  It was mentioned the pump only needs to run a little to aerate the water.  I put it on a new timer for 5 min on 25 min off and now my temp is stable at approximately 71 deg F.  I also figured out that the control panel backlight won't turn off.  I remember that used to so that's probably something also causing more heat but that's unplugged now as well.  

Can anyone confirm that the 5 min on 25 min off will be alright?  I have the old Aerogarden Ultra LED but I can't find out if the newer similar models like the Bounty Basic run 24/7 for high growth mode.  I also wonder if it's because I haven't cleaned my pump before.  Maybe it has some roots and gunk causing it to run hotter than typical or maybe it has always run hot.  I can't find much info on this subject and have a replacement pump I could try but will probably kill my plants if I install the replacement pump.  This website aerogarden.com/learning/the-pump-is-not-working-in-my-aerogarden.html has some details but not really enough details.

I also heard that there are DC versions of this same pump such as www.amazon.com/ZAOJIAO-Submersible-Fountain-Brushless-Aquarium/dp/B07WFZSG95/ref=asc_df_B07WFZSG95/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=475740782809&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=15079360424039368818&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033594&hvtargid=pla-1025965944923&psc=1 that are more quite but can't find much info for that as well to help with temperature if 5min on 25min off doesn't work.

[katyag247]

The default pump setting for tomatoes and peppers on the Bounty models is for the pump to run constantly.  I tinkered with the pump settings and accidentally used the 5 on 25 off pump setting on one Bounty unit for a few weeks -- the tomatoes growing in that unit did not seem to suffer at all.  Try the 5 on 25 off and see how it works for you.  

[Shawn]

Jan 26, 2023 22:11:51 GMT -5 katyag247 said:

The default pump setting for tomatoes and peppers on the Bounty models is for the pump to run constantly.  I tinkered with the pump settings and accidentally used the 5 on 25 off pump setting on one Bounty unit for a few weeks -- the tomatoes growing in that unit did not seem to suffer at all.  Try the 5 on 25 off and see how it works for you.  

I use this setting often.,